The former head of the 2025 program believes that in the first 100 days of the second term, President Donald Trump made huge progress to remove liberal gains dating back to Franklin D. Roosevelt.
But Paul Dans led efforts to develop a detailed conservative transition plan and policy blueprint, the center of last year’s presidential election, who believes the president needs to pour in new lawyers to fight for policies in his court. Dance told NBC News that the fights will be shaped over the next 100 days.
"If Roosevelt had a new deal, that's what I think Trump really did," Dance said. "It was deconstructing the executive state and gradually withdrawing many of the progressive buildings that the FDR had built."
"The next thing is actually a balance with the court, and of course, that's going to reach the boiling point, so that's going to be addressed," Dance said.
Prior to the 2024 campaign, the 2025 project led by Dans was supervised by the Heritage Foundation, which has the basic premise of establishing a future right-wing administration on Day 1, with more preparation and planning than Trump’s first term. Much of the 2025 project focuses on the fundamental restructuring of civil servants and provides a potential MAGA-inspired employee database in the new administration.
But it's a 900-page memorandum outlining many of the policy positions that the government should consider in the future, which has attracted the greatest attention of the Democrats, as the Democrats have said. Although many of the policies contained in the document reflect the policies Trump promised to develop in his own plans, the president and his campaign are still far from Project 2025. Dans, who worked in Trump's first administration, was forced to leave his position in the summer as anger over the campaign increased.
However, after Trump won, he hired several authors of the report in key positions, including Russell Vourch, director of management and budgeting, immigration tsar Tom Homan, top trade adviser Peter Navarro and FCC chair Brendan Carr, among others. NBC News reported during the transition period that the transition team also leveraged the project database of 2025 potential employees.
The blueprint ultimately foreshadows a lot of what Trump has ever issued or tried that power. An independent tracker found that the government has completed or taken measures on about 40% of the material in the 2025 project blueprint. This includes everything from cutting research grants to colleges to preparing for cuts Climate research, depriving some immigrants of temporary protection status, and a full-scale attack on government diversification plans.
Dance spoke with NBC News in two interviews in recent days as Trump reached a 100-day record. He doesn't think measuring Trump's plans for the 2025 project is "really accurate", adding: "It's certain that President Trump's own policies, many of which are reflected in the 2025 project."
“What I read every day is exciting to see new steps they take,” Dance said. “But it’s certain that this has to be implemented. At this point, a lot of executive orders and things like that are policy statements, and real rubber will go to the path in implementing all of these directives.”
But with few new laws that are severely divided by Congress, Trump’s enforcement initiatives—whether it’s immigration, civil servants or federal government funds—are kidnapped in court struggles, which will be key to determining how far the president can go.
"Many of us always see it as the ultimate final game, and that's where both sides will meet," Dance said. "It depends on having the right people. Ultimately, you need a passionate advocate for Maga and ready to fight their opponents. … It's for sure that this is the next step for everyone's eyes."
"He needs to do more reinforcements in his team because this speed slows down the consuming war with deep states, especially in terms of law," Dance said. "While he can continue to bring his team to the venue, it's a must."
On Monday, Trump said on his truth social platform that his administration has so far hired more than 80% of political appointment positions in some of the largest institutions, including the Justice, State, Defense and Treasury Departments. These positions constitute a small amount of work in each agency, but Trump has recently taken action to reclassify many federal workers to make them easier to replace.
The government has suffered some setbacks in court. The consequences of Kilmar Abrego Garcia's deportation from El Salvador began when the government said in court documents that it was deported due to "administrative error." Last week, the administration said in Manhattan’s office that it had mistakenly submitted a memorandum detailing weaknesses in the administration’s arguments and strategies.
"This is a place of concern," Dance said. The government's need: "Are there enough magical elites to satisfy in the top legal thinking"?
"I think it's the government's real responsibility to get them to Washington and put it into practice," Dance continued.
Given the Central Deconstruction Center for Projection in 2025, it has been Dance's mind to improve the magazine.
"It is essentially important that the 2025 project determines the administrative status as the main obstacle to achieving change," Dance said.
He added that the Trump administration has not “fired enough people.” With Trump recently adopted a policy called Schedule F - a reclassification of some professional government employees to make them easier to remove - Dance said he wants to see "more things happen."
Dans praised Musk and his efforts as the tech giant announced this month that he will soon spend more time on his business interests and reduce the time he spends in the government.
"Without a threshold, I don't believe that none of them can be achieved at its speed," Dance said, adding that its structure remains a necessary condition for achieving Trump's goals in the coming months. "It's a great 100-day mark and a watershed in history. It's a slam of the door of the progressive era."
However, Dance does offer some caution about AI policies as Trump attempts to abandon restrictions around AI by executing orders, while Musk and Doch have already implemented AI programs at certain federal agencies.
"AI has produced MRI for Blobs, and now we can actually make connections with what was previously impossible, and in one weekend, it may have taken two years of research," Dance said.
When Trump hit his administration’s 100-day mark, the polls flashed several warning signs for him on signature issues such as immigration and the economy as the deportation of prisons in El Salvador and the president’s global tariffs headlines.
However, Dance said Trump is targeting and retains the mission of "completely changing".
"It's Trump, without restraints, able to do what he promised to the American people," he said. "There is no script there to restore the country. It's intuitive for him and everyone else. It's a person with ups and downs. It's a long-term proposition. So there will be some short-term pain, but long-term benefits."
Dans said he was eager to see more reforms in the Ministry of Defense, including the agency’s “massive reuse” as it gradually increased its focus on Asia, which he believed would be coming once Ukraine has a reconciliation. He also hopes to see Trump take action on a policy he proposed during the campaign, but has paid little attention in recent months: the construction of 10 "free cities" on federal land.
"I always thought it was an interesting Trump idea," Dance said. "It captures everyone's imagination and can build something new. He's the builder. So the first part of the building is demolition, but he's going to get into the construction phase soon."
Looking ahead to 2028, Dance said there is no need for the 2029 project.
"We have President Trump in power now, and he has a team," Dance said. "The premise of the 2025 project is that as conservatives, we need to get together. We are a bunch of cats, often scratching each other, and we need to start moving on this line. That's what the 2025 project does."
"And I think not only our initiatives, but other presidential transition programs do lay this time for that," Dance continued. "President Trump certainly came out and played a role with 100% correct urgency."